Chinese bow identification help needed

Hi!
Now Warsaw is not only hot but rain :-) But this is all over Poland.

TradArcher wrote:

Question probably to Stephen, I just bought antique chinese bow,can you help me with identification please..

Pics on my web album

http://picasaweb.google.pl/tradarcher/C ... directlink

This bow was made in Beijing in the second half of the 19th century. The string bridges are missing; but the rest seems in good condition. Check the horn tips of the bow to see if there is a maker's mark impressed with a hot iron. If there is not, it is likely to have been made before 1880.

If you decide to have new string bridges made, they should be made of deer antler taken from the place where the antler forks.

S

Stephen, thank you for so precise answer. There is no marks (examined inch by inch :) ) except those on raya skin near cork cover. By the way, it is possible to read its meaning?
Now Im going to put varnish on as birchbark slightly exfoliates. Missing bridges where almost ready made of exotic wood but I will wait for antler following your suggestion.

Thank you and best regards
Janek

I may have some deer antler scrap at home. I'll check. If you plan to add lacquer, please consider carefully. Such treatment can't be reversed. Please check with your museum expert what product they use to fix the surface of old paintings. These old bows are getting rare and we should preserve them carefully.

In the stingray skin near the cork grip, there are usually two symbols. Sometimes it is a circle (sun) and ellipse (moon). Ir it might be two flowers. However, your bow is different: this is very unusual. There are two characters and I have some difficulty in reading them at present. The top one may be Zi (子) and the bottom may be Yuan (遠).

The purpose is to remind the archer which way up the bow should be held moon=yin=weaker) limb up (to compensate for gripping the bow above the centre).

I applied natural Damar Varnish (two layers in 24h) used for paintings, colors and shapes of birchbark became vivid and I can see that helped out for exfoliation problem. By the way Adam Karpowicz can give us some insight in general as he is pro ( I guess there is lot of old stuff among us) but I think there is no one universal solution.

It is complicated, and the best answer is to ask a professional conservator. By exfoliattion I understand the bark peels in small flakes or something like that. Such defect is taken care of first, and is not the same as varnishing. Special adhesives are used to re-attach the peeling bark etc (one of the choices is actually gelatine or even isinglass in certain cases). Then the varnish is put on if needed, usually after cleaning the object. These sequence assures the varnish can be removed without harming the finish and bark. Applying damar alone to stick the bits and give the bow some gloos is not the same. If someone would ever want to clean the bow or restore it, the dammar varnish has to be removed. It will now not be possible without damage, because the loose bits of paint and bark will come off together with the varnish.

If one does not want to be bothered by all this, it is much better to put on an acrylic varnish from an art store, but is must be a solvent base type, not water based (not the milky emulsion types). Acrylics at least do not yellow or darken with time, as the dammar varnish will.

Adam

Hmm, so I did wrong :(
Before varnishing I applied under all birch flakes cyanoacrilic glue with needle so I hope it will be OK. Adam, it is any other fluid I can put on damar varnish to minimalize effects of my mistake? Im so angry at myself that I forgot about gelatine...

Janek

Hi Stephen,

That's some good information. I knew the maker's marks got in use rather late but couldn't put a date on it. Could you tell me what source states the 1880's?

Good to know the string bridges are from the place the antler forks, I was already wondering how they got them that wide.

When I examined the Qing bows in the Metropolitan Museum I also noticed that when I had a group of bows placed next to each-other the handles were not all on the same place. When turning some around, all handles fell on the same place again. They were all slightly asymmetrical, but so that it is hardly visible with the naked eye. Upon coming home I measured my bows, and they were the same: all slightly asymmetrical.

I also got a bow here that has two eternal knots placed near the handle, one is rounded and the other angular in shape to keep both sides apart. Would this also have a deeper meaning, perhaps referring to other meanings of the sounds fang and yuan?

Here is the handle:
[external image]

BTW nice find Janek, I quite like this type of Manchu / Chinese bow as their "camouflage" bark patterns that remind of those used from the early days of conquest to the height of the Qing. The style endured on the better bows up until the late nineteenth century.

It is also the first time I see characters on either side of the handle, very interesting.

-Peter

Looks like this bow had a previous decoration. Maybe a hidden personna. -j-

Hi Jack,

How do you mean, previous decoration?

-Peter

Peter; i own a bow like this covered in elaborate birchbark decoration. But by scrutinizing it with a magnifier it is evident that it used to be painted red before that. Am I seeing remnants of another decoration scheme on the posted bow?

PS your Korean presentation on Qing bows was very insightful and informative.

Hi Jack,

This is interesting, this bow also has a pretty elaborate pattern on the back with small pieces of bark. It is however, for the most part red. As far as I have been able to determine, all is original on this one except for one of the nocks being recently replaced.

Where do you spot these remnants, exactly?

Thanks for the compliment, so you've been able to get the article? I will give another presentation this year, getting more into Manchu archery equipment itself.

-Peter

Peter; Excuse my confusion, I was talking about Janek's bow, image 28 of 31. there is some red paint.

On mine the upper siyahs both have dings on them which show color from beneath.

I also own a Chinese pellet bow which is decorated over the hinge; which is a retro fit is it not?

I am sure that if you were to allow your 2008 article to be published here that everyone would enjoy this. Better to also publish here to appeal to another audience. I look forward to hearing you at WTAF and seeing you again. -j-

Hi Jack,

Thanks for clearing that up. I was thinking you have some hawk eyes seeing things on a pic that I can't see handling my own bow!

On pic 28, it is unlikely that it is different decoration underneath in this case, as the portion we are looking at is the horn belly. I've seen such bows with red paper pasted on them, sometimes bearing Chinese characters. Those I've seen were too far gone to see what they once said, but I can imagine we are seeing something similar here. It could also be traces of paint, antiques sometimes get (unintentional?) paint-jobs somewhere in their life.

I've had some kind of paint appear from under layers of these bows before, usually under the ray-skin. The colors are usually one of the colors used on the ray-skin itself, but often appear a lot brighter because they have been hidden from the elements for most of the time. Perhaps they were some kind of under coating, or a by-product of the colored ray-skin glued on for such a long time. You see it here as well, bright white under the damage at the ray-skin pieces on either side of the handle. I've had some with bright green pigment showing through under damaged green ray-skin.

It would be interesting to take a closer look at the red under the covering of your ears.

-Peter