dimensions??
Little frustrated, about 10 years ago I built my first and only Turkish bow was very proud, then a Korean composite that didnt come out as nice none the less I was happy. I then got married. Since then I have been gathering the material to start again. What I am lacking and I cant figure out is where did I get the dimensions for my first bow? I have looked through Adams book but cant seem to find info on let say length of Kasan when I have a 44 ntn bow. I there a formula for length of sal compared to the Kasan? Horn has gone up in price since then I dont want to experiment too much. Could someone point me in the right direction? Also living on the west coast finding green hickory or maple suitable has proven difficult but I do have kiln dried lumber I use for selfbow, is this suitable? Thanks
Amaguk;
There is, in Peter's book a large (2 page) table of dimensions from over a hundred bows. My copy is an ebook, so I can't really give you page numbers.
There is a text description of both a long (47") and a short light draw bow (44" 40#) in the Chapter called OTTOMAN BOWS, about 12 pages in from and subsection called Design. The tables I mentioned are just a page or two before the chapter called MATERIALS.
There is, in Peter's book a large (2 page) table of dimensions from over a hundred bows. My copy is an ebook, so I can't really give you page numbers.
There is a text description of both a long (47") and a short light draw bow (44" 40#) in the Chapter called OTTOMAN BOWS, about 12 pages in from and subsection called Design. The tables I mentioned are just a page or two before the chapter called MATERIALS.
Thanks Ken. Which book are you speaking of? Thank you very much for your time.
Sorry-- I meant to say Adam Karpowicz' Ottoman Turkish Bows...
There isn't really a set length. A shorter kasan will mean less stress on the sals and vice versa. Do you want to make a warbow style or a flight bow?
The kiln dried wood will be unlikely to steam bend well. Maple would be the best choice over hickory.
The kiln dried wood will be unlikely to steam bend well. Maple would be the best choice over hickory.
Hey Mike thanks I have plenty of maple I have successfully bent so I guess I will stick with that. I like light bows in the 40s since my shoulders are bad. The Korean bow I made I loved until I broke it. I would attempt to make another but having a hard time finding appropriate bamboo for the job. Also I have many bamboo slates that have been kiln dried for backing long bows. Do you think those would work for a core if planned flat? I am tired of experimenting but I think I might just go for it. Thanks again.
I have made a Korean style bow with a maple core. 3 piece like Turkish construction. I don't have any experience with bamboo but I know how picky the Koreans are about selecting the 'right' stuff.
I've just finished a short 39 ntn Turkish flight bow that is around 45# to practise flight shooting with.
Good luck with your bow.
I've just finished a short 39 ntn Turkish flight bow that is around 45# to practise flight shooting with.
Good luck with your bow.
I'm going to try to make a 35-40# Turkish bow based on the "short light draw" bow in Adam's book. Three piece maple core. I'm aiming for 5mm thickness for each element to keep the draw weight down. I've got my core cut to length and the V splices cut as well. Now I have to source glue.
Do you mean 5mm horn, 5mm wood and 5mm sinew? 15mm sal thickness for a short light bow :shock:
My shooting bow is a Moshevaya Balka type, much longer ntn, about 10 mm total thickness. Was like 50-55 @ 28 when new.
Adam Karpowicz made a 160# crim tatar and it was around 16mm. See this thread: http://atarn.net/phpBB2/forum5/topic248 ... 3642552fd9
My shooting bow is a Moshevaya Balka type, much longer ntn, about 10 mm total thickness. Was like 50-55 @ 28 when new.
Adam Karpowicz made a 160# crim tatar and it was around 16mm. See this thread: http://atarn.net/phpBB2/forum5/topic248 ... 3642552fd9
Yes Lurz - 5mm thickness for each element. That's what was recommended by Adam in his book, as well as a couple other builders that I respect, for a draw weight 40# or less @26" draw. However, it does seem a bit thick to me as well, and may well get reduced as things progress.
Can't find it, do you have page number?
In my (print) version, in the table at p.41, the weakest bow is a 50 pound war/target bow with a thickness at mid sal given as 10.4mm
A 70 pound bow above it is given as 12.4mm at mid sal.
At page 43 dimensions for a generic longer bow of 47" ntn a thickness of 12mm is given for a weight of 60-70 pound.
Small variations in thickness gives large changes i draw-weight
In my (print) version, in the table at p.41, the weakest bow is a 50 pound war/target bow with a thickness at mid sal given as 10.4mm
A 70 pound bow above it is given as 12.4mm at mid sal.
At page 43 dimensions for a generic longer bow of 47" ntn a thickness of 12mm is given for a weight of 60-70 pound.
Small variations in thickness gives large changes i draw-weight
My copy of The Book is electronic, so doesn't have page numbers. Before that table is a discussion of design, and Adam first talks about a larger, heavier bow. The he gives dimensions for a "very short" 41", 45# @ 26 bow and talks about how to lighten it up some -- I am going wider. I'm starting with 5mm core etc. but plan on reducing it to 4mm prior to bending, perhaps 3mm in the areas that are bent. The horn may go on at 4mm but will undoubtedly get reduced, perhaps to 2mm; likewise the sinew will go on slowly.
Yes 15mm thick sals will give over 100# :)
Nothing wrong with trying to keep each layer the same thickness per se but for a light bow the horn wouldn't need to be over 3mm thick. Sinew max 2mm. It would be beneficial to have more wood because of its lower density than sinew and horn. For a 40# @ 26 42 - 44 inch length bow I would aim for the mid sal around 9mm, thinnest spot around 8mm.
Nothing wrong with trying to keep each layer the same thickness per se but for a light bow the horn wouldn't need to be over 3mm thick. Sinew max 2mm. It would be beneficial to have more wood because of its lower density than sinew and horn. For a 40# @ 26 42 - 44 inch length bow I would aim for the mid sal around 9mm, thinnest spot around 8mm.
You should leave the core thick when bending and gluing horn. Reduce thickness/width only once the horn is glued. Thicker wood acts like its own form and reduces the chance of twist being induced when you glue the horn. Even using clamps its is very easy to misalign the core.
Thanks Mike! You're right about the core acting as a sort of form while the horn is being glued up. This is all real new for me. I've made wood self bows, wood-wood composites, wood-fiberglass composites and PVC bows, but this is my first horn bow. In addition to Adam's book I have a "working man's tutorial" on the building process written by Beaumont Vance, who you may know from ATARN Facebook. The two works are very complementary.
No problem, good luck with your bow. No I don't know him. I wouldn't go on fakebook if I was paid haha! It is a shame that people get suckered into whatever is offered to them but heyho.
Yes, good luck with the bow! I first thought you was going to have 15mm finished sal, that would be heavy. Thinning later makes sense. I like to have the wood core closer to 10 mm at the start, then laminate with horn ready thicknessed. After that take the wood down to right thickness before sinewing .
Thanks again, Mike -- I'll aim for 8-9mm thickness then.