Manchu bow ?

Why don't you write link instead of posting pictures? I know that bow from Webarcherie. Thank you for that last picture. Beautiful bow I must say.

I would like to see that bow......why not use image hosting (free)?

for instance: http://www.imagevenue.com/

No more quota problem. Here we go again

the 2 horns at the handle. One was shorter than the other and got unglued by time.

China Qing imperial court particular period , the bow ( sturdy solid ) that the genuine battle of north is used . Has the cushion of chord dropped ? There is not the big injury ? If good fortune can repair ! :P :P :P :P

romain
can you show more picture more side? horn, sinew , and siyah(long ear)the length of lamb and siyah,
the thickness of sinew, horn ,wood

thanks

This looks like one of the bows used in the Qing military examinations to test the strength of the candidates. Sometimes they had a number between 1 and 5 written on them to indicate their power.

They would have had string bridges originally, but they were on glued and bound on, so they could be lost after many years.

Check the horn near the grip. Rather than two uneven horns there may be another join on the other side of the grip under the sinew wrapping. I have seen bows where a piece of horn was placed on the belly of the grip To join arm pieces that were not long enough. Because it was probably meant only for drawing and not shooting, two uneven horns could have been used.

Thanks for your comments. I meant to post more pictures but got interrupted this morning.

We go on with the handle.

Uneven horns or a separate extra piece ? My bet is on 2 different length horns... but to be sure, I would have to remove one of the few remaining sinew thread....

Siyah details

In English (left then right) :

The core stops there---->

The horn stops there---->

On the previous picture, also :
Length of the siyah after core : 28.5 cm
Depth of the siyah at bow tip : 3.5 cm

Siyah angle + curve

siyah knee. You can see the V splice

Thanks for posting the pictures.

I have some questions regarding the decoration of northern style Qing bows
which I would like to ask someone, who has really seen a lot of them:

1. What material/bark exactly was used to cover grip?
2. above & beneath the handle, there is often another patch of leather.
Is this generally green dyed ray skin, or where other materials being used?
(such as frog skin or shark skin)
3. On old mandshu archer paintings the siyahs appear whitish - was white rayskin applied on them, or was this the freedom of the artists?
4. Was the birch bark on the limbs applied horizontal or vertical (following
the design of the bark)?
5.How was the design brought on the birchbark? Was it just painted on the bark, or where dark dyed- cut out patches of bark glued on the 1st layer to get the charcteristic design?

Sorry for the many questions.These are some things I allways wanted to know about. I hope someone can answer them.

I think this a shooting bow rather than a strength-testing bow. From the curvature of the siyahs, I'd suggest it is relatively early: say first half of 19th century.

The strong recurve is a result of excessive drying: this bow may have been hung in the eaves of a house for many years. When in use, these bows were not recurved like that: the limbs would have been much streighter.

Alam; I am not your expert but will keep the conversation going till one arrives. I have several Qing bows.

1.Some very thick cork-like birch bark is often used at the grip. I believe that I have also seen shagreen-green dyed ray skin. There is also cork to be seen.

2.Those chafe guards can be shagreen, or leather or even thick paper dyed green. Often, they will be birch bark with perpendicular pattern.

3.Siyahs may be white shagreen on superior bows or painted variously on others.

4.Diagonally arranged bark on the limbs is common, perpendicular on the grip, parallel on the upper siyah.

5. That tiger-stripe pattern is painted directly on the bark. On others, painted bark flowers,etc are glued over the first layer. Painted paper elements are also glued to the background on some. Shagreen is inlaid into shagreen on first quality items.

Others have more experience. Romain, I am very jealous of this bow. -j-

Romain, I am very jealous of this bow. -j-

Really ? I know at least one more like this for sale (a bit less massive, maybe)

I can add something to what Jack wrote.

The cork is real cork. There are cork oaks in Korean and the Manchus had a long historical connection with the Koreans.

Polished shark and other fish skins are used above and below the handle. I believe that in their native state they are white and dyed to get the other colours. A bow in my possession has pieces that appear to have been put together like a mosaic. Individual denticals from the skin were dyed different colours to form an image. On my old bow, the coloured scales started to drop out. I assume that they were removed, dyed and replaced. The majority of the skin was dyed a single colour.

On my bow the birch bark covering of the back was applied diagonally. The usual reason for this was to reduce the forming of gaps between the individual strips. My bow was shootable until a few decades ago and never showed any sign of gaps appearing when fully drawn. It should be easy to test the theory by sticking strips of tape on a wooden bow and bending it. A second person could measure the gaps.

As Jack said, many bows had the ears covered in shark skin. On others, the ears were painted.

Stephen is the best person to comment on this because he has probably seen more bows with a better educated eye than any of us.

Thank you, Bede, Jack, :D

very interesting what you say. The "tigerdesign" on the bark - I never thought of a tiger, but now as you said it - Yes! So shagreen was the novelty
decoration material used.Or even mosaik, by dying the little denticals
individually.(I read on a shagreen page, that the denticals are best dyed from the backside of the skin) Could such a design be the signature of the bowyers workshop?
All my questions have been answered. Bede, you said what I already thought - kork was being used for the grip. I am planning to build a Mandshu bow after I gathered enough information/materials. Jack, did you build one?

There is also decoration on the horn - is this some sort of bone/ivory inlay work or is this design simply painted on the on the horn?
(I repost some pictures of the shagreen section at the grip- from-some pics of bows from the web) Just to look at it again.....

The designs on the arrow-pass (a bat, a coin and a lily) are all lucky symbols (fortune, wealth, refinement) to assure the owner of success in the official examinations. The designs also help the user hold the bow the correct way up: ther coin was always on the upper limb and the lily on the lower. (Sometimes it was a circle (sun) on the upper limb and moon on the lower.)

The grecian key pattern near the arrow pass was done in peach bark. The design is called 'wan nian bu duan tou' (万年不断头) and signifies 'never dying'.

I don't suppose my friend Constantine (Tyke) Antonopolous would mind my showing his very refined bow. -j-

Steven,
Thanks for explaining the meaning of those symbols. :D
Things are coming more into focus now, which is really great. Difficult to imagine how such an intricate pattern (the grecian like key pattern) could be cut from peach bark - I know nothing about peach bark at all - is there, besides the dark variety of bark, one that has this ivory colouring? Or, maybe I got this all wrong.....?

Jack:
Thanks for posting this pictures.Nice decoration on that bow.:D

Steven: I would like to ask you another question:
Did the Tibetan community have their own bow design, or did they generally use Mandshu design with somewhat shortened siyahs ? Where those lucky symbols also used by them, or where those Chinese imperical military issues?

Closeup.

The peach bark was applied as marquetry.

Tibetan archery is divided into northern and southern. Northern bows are similar to Manchu bows, but shorter. And the Tibetans do not favour long siyahs. Southern archery is more along the lines now practised in Bhutan, with simple bamboo bows.

In terms of decoration, often the Tibetans use old Manchu bows and just cut the siyahs down. Occasionally they add their own decoration, with Buddhist lucky symbols. However, they also often follow the Chinese lucky symbols. When shooting, the tie a red or pale blue ribbon on the bow.

Thank you Steven.

Hello Romain,

How are you lately? Did you managed to string that bow, or just for your collection purpose?

Best regards,

Greg

just hanging on the wall ! I'm not brave enough to string that old monster...