Mughal Bamboo arrow in SAMA
Was visiting to the San Antonio, Texas, Museum of Art and photographed this lone Mughal arrow. This is the only provenience. One thing I mean to do is to collect some information on how to tell the different areas of Indian arrow manufacture apart.
This is speculation but I have always considered the well finished arrows with metal ferules at the points as a northern attribute. I think this because the fine Persian decoration on many of these arrows reminds me of Kashmiri work seen elsewhere. Many of those superlatively finished bows are described as "Northern" India.
In contrast this simple arrow with rough nock and simple point, twisted wrapping at the point reminds me of another area. Nevertheless the point, which appears to be armor piercing is probably good steel, the shaft is bamboo and the nock is very long. The arrow looks well used.
I have seen other, let me say "Southern", arrows which are also not so finely finished as northern ones; yet it would be hasty to say that they are not as serviceable.
Has anyone been to India who can provide pictures on subject? -j-
This is speculation but I have always considered the well finished arrows with metal ferules at the points as a northern attribute. I think this because the fine Persian decoration on many of these arrows reminds me of Kashmiri work seen elsewhere. Many of those superlatively finished bows are described as "Northern" India.
In contrast this simple arrow with rough nock and simple point, twisted wrapping at the point reminds me of another area. Nevertheless the point, which appears to be armor piercing is probably good steel, the shaft is bamboo and the nock is very long. The arrow looks well used.
I have seen other, let me say "Southern", arrows which are also not so finely finished as northern ones; yet it would be hasty to say that they are not as serviceable.
Has anyone been to India who can provide pictures on subject? -j-
More
And
For business purpose I spent many days, weeks in India and I had the time to do some travelling. Attached please find some pictures of arrows. Some are from the museums, some are from my private collection.
Currently I am working on some replicas (about 50 arrows). I also attach pictures of arrowheads Mysha (ATARN member) made for me and will be used. It will still take some time to finish, but I keep you updated.
Reto
PS: all the arrows and crab bows I have, are from the Northern Part from India (Rajhastan).
Currently I am working on some replicas (about 50 arrows). I also attach pictures of arrowheads Mysha (ATARN member) made for me and will be used. It will still take some time to finish, but I keep you updated.
Reto
PS: all the arrows and crab bows I have, are from the Northern Part from India (Rajhastan).
..
..
..
..
Sorry, you have reached your maximum Upload Quota Limit of 10 MB
Stephen, can you help please?
Sorry, you have reached your maximum Upload Quota Limit of 10 MB
Stephen, can you help please?
Done :DReto wrote:
..
Sorry, you have reached your maximum Upload Quota Limit of 10 MB
Stephen, can you help please?
...
...
...
,,
... Arrowheads from my arrows I asked for replicas
... Arrowheads from my arrows I asked for replicas
...
M??a has all the dimension in case you are interested in Indo-Persian arrowheads......
Reto; Good pictures, as usual for you. Are the red and green arrows on page one from Rajistan, then? And what of the others with the pieced together metal ferules at the points? Going to Korea? -j-
... the red,green arrows are from its origin area/province Rajistan (... now in a Museum) :wink: . The pictures with the arrowheads are made for the arrowsmith so I can do my replicas. They are from my arrows I bought during my last business trip in India. I have a small, but nice, private collection of Indian arrows.
I am afraid this year I cannot come to Korea due to the return home. We get our belongings/container stuff by end of September and move in our new home by Oct 1st, 2009. I will try to make it next year.
Reto
I am afraid this year I cannot come to Korea due to the return home. We get our belongings/container stuff by end of September and move in our new home by Oct 1st, 2009. I will try to make it next year.
Reto
Mr Farrell,the arrow in the texas meuseum seems more like an arrow from one of the muslim principalities rather than Kashmiri,I could be wrong ofcourse but I have seen arrows similar the one you have photographed in uttarpradesh.
Reto; Did you notice the splice in the shafts of the first red arrows? How about your own arrows? Are they spliced?
The second set is somewhat of a tool kit in that they all have the same crest but are of different lengths and radically different point weights. Thanks for sharing and the link was good to see again.
When I see those narrow quiver tubes like the ones in the link I am reminded of flight shooting because so few arrows fit into them and they often lack any method to wear them.
PJ Singh; I noticed on wikipedia that Uttar Pradesh contains some tribal areas. This is what i would have expected of the SAMA arrow. Do you have any pictures of Indian arrows with provenience?
The second set is somewhat of a tool kit in that they all have the same crest but are of different lengths and radically different point weights. Thanks for sharing and the link was good to see again.
When I see those narrow quiver tubes like the ones in the link I am reminded of flight shooting because so few arrows fit into them and they often lack any method to wear them.
PJ Singh; I noticed on wikipedia that Uttar Pradesh contains some tribal areas. This is what i would have expected of the SAMA arrow. Do you have any pictures of Indian arrows with provenience?
Mr,Farrell unfortunately I do not have any pictures of the arrows that I saw in India as I was out with some friends and these people i met were out hunting in the same area as us and they were carrying bows and arrows,they were bhil tribals.Surprisingly these tribals do not use a thumb draw but 3 fingers with a very interesting story that goes along with it.
It's your nickel.
I have a neat slow motion video of such arrow hitting a metal plate I made a couple of months ago, but can not show it yet due to the copyright issues with a TV company which owns. The thin bamboo shaft flexes greatly, but the arrow penetration is quite good.
Adam
Adam
Reto sent this message; Hi Jack
I am currently working on 5 Indo Persian arrows, because I will get the arrowheads beginning of October, after arrival of our stuff from Shanghai.
Question: how about colors and paintings on bamboo. Does it stay on the arrow shaft and how about the hide glue on the feathers on the painting. Did you have some problems with one of them? How do your arrows look like after usage/certain period of time?
I made a test and the colors went a little bit off, so I decided to paint it twice before putting on the decoration and latter on the feathers.
Thanks for your reply maybe on your existing post about SAMA arrows, ....
Best regards
Reto
PS: Can u post me some pics of your Indio-Persian arrows?
Reto; These are a new set of blunts in the Indo-Persian taste which I am taking to Korea to shoot at Mongolian style targets.
The paint is put directly on the prepared shaft which has been well sanded with #100 grit paper. The paint is Testors paint for model makers bought at the art store in incredibly small glass jars. It dries in minutes and holds up very well for years. The designs are authentic. 23k goldleaf and paper checkerboard crest.
A thin line is scraped off the paint down to bare wood to attach the fletch. I prefer tightbond glue because it adheres quickly.
I am currently working on 5 Indo Persian arrows, because I will get the arrowheads beginning of October, after arrival of our stuff from Shanghai.
Question: how about colors and paintings on bamboo. Does it stay on the arrow shaft and how about the hide glue on the feathers on the painting. Did you have some problems with one of them? How do your arrows look like after usage/certain period of time?
I made a test and the colors went a little bit off, so I decided to paint it twice before putting on the decoration and latter on the feathers.
Thanks for your reply maybe on your existing post about SAMA arrows, ....
Best regards
Reto
PS: Can u post me some pics of your Indio-Persian arrows?
Reto; These are a new set of blunts in the Indo-Persian taste which I am taking to Korea to shoot at Mongolian style targets.
The paint is put directly on the prepared shaft which has been well sanded with #100 grit paper. The paint is Testors paint for model makers bought at the art store in incredibly small glass jars. It dries in minutes and holds up very well for years. The designs are authentic. 23k goldleaf and paper checkerboard crest.
A thin line is scraped off the paint down to bare wood to attach the fletch. I prefer tightbond glue because it adheres quickly.
The designs are the same but put on randomly. Each arrow is individual but is hard to tell apart. Goose 4-fletch.
Dogwood stick blunts with a small steel insert face. Arrow weight 24 grams. Wild black cherry bark.
Hi Jack
Thanks a lot for the great pictures! I am so sorry I cannot make it to join you in Korea.
I am at the very beginning of the process and now I have to go the the shop again to change. The feathers will be from goose (I need to finish also) and the arrowheads I will put on after arrival of our stuff in October
Attached one picture of my test about color, glue and feathers, which was the reason to ask you...
The final arrows will look differently, I will give my best.
Best regards
Reto
Thanks a lot for the great pictures! I am so sorry I cannot make it to join you in Korea.
I am at the very beginning of the process and now I have to go the the shop again to change. The feathers will be from goose (I need to finish also) and the arrowheads I will put on after arrival of our stuff in October
Attached one picture of my test about color, glue and feathers, which was the reason to ask you...
The final arrows will look differently, I will give my best.
Best regards
Reto
... and here a picture of the 5 bamboo shafts I am working on...
Reto
PS: I will keep you updated, once I have finished them
Reto
PS: I will keep you updated, once I have finished them
Nice arrows Jack,I like the testors paints myself.The way the original gold paint was produced in India was by mixing gold leaf with gumarabica.I tried it and it works really well.
PJ; Applying gold leaf is a profession by itself. I am just an amateur though have been doing it for years. The effect is regal. Grayson has arrows crested over gold. Have not tried that yet but will eventually.
Do you chop up the leaf before mixing? Please give a formula, technique. -j-
Do you chop up the leaf before mixing? Please give a formula, technique. -j-
The way they did it in the old days was by using gold dust mixed directly to the gum arabica which has been pounded to a fine powder in a mortar and pestle and then add a few drops of water to get it to a paintable consistency,or you can use terpentine or pine oil.On a funny note the ayurvedic doctors used to prescribe gumarabica for people effected with premature ej--------,lol.
was going over some of my notes and found that the basic formuls is powedered gum arabica and water mixed with the pigment to reach desired consistency and then the polish that was applied had pine oil and terpentine and shellac mixed in.some of the pigments used were onion skin for yellow,copper sulphate,rust,soot for black,made traditionaly as the japanese still do,ground saffaron for orange.These were the traditional things used and the domain of the rich as the paintings were done over long periods requiring many hours as well as the fact that the artists capable of doing them were usually under the employment of the king/maharajah/nawab and did nothing else other that the works comissioned by them.
You can size the surface of the arrow with a thin coat of hide glue. This will make it easier for the paint to adhere and also aid in gluing on the fletching with an animal glue.
I have seen some evidence of a gesso base being used but I have not seen any analyses yet.
I am attaching some pictures from a recent visit to the Grayson Collection. One is of the shaftment of a highly decorated Ottoman arrow and the other is of three Indian arrows of the Moghul period.
I have seen some evidence of a gesso base being used but I have not seen any analyses yet.
I am attaching some pictures from a recent visit to the Grayson Collection. One is of the shaftment of a highly decorated Ottoman arrow and the other is of three Indian arrows of the Moghul period.
Bede, the cock feather on the top of the ottoman war shaft, is it longer than the hen feathers?