draw weight decrease from Tang/Song to Ming/Qing
I was looking through Stephen Selby's "Chinese Archery" to get a sense of the draw weights used and noticed a trend where the draw weights became lighter in later dynasties.
In the Tang dynasty (618--907 AD), the examination syllabus prescribed 1 stone (168#) for infantry archery, and 7 dou (93#) for mounted archery [p. 196]. In the Song dynasty (960--1279 AD), the examination syllabus prescribed 1 stone to 1 stone + 1 dou (148--160#) for infantry archery, and 7--8 dou (104--120#) for mounted archery [paragraph 10Q1].
However, in the Ming dynasty (1368--1644 AD), Li Chengfen's manual mentions draw weights in the range 3--8 li (36--96#), with exceptional archers shooting 9--10 li (108--120#) [paragraphs 11C9, 11C11]. Also, in the Qing Dynasty (1644--1911 AD), we see draw weights ranging from 30 kg (66#) to 8 li (104#) [p. 346, paragraph 12D1, footnote 27 on p. 352] --- and I'm not including the strength testing bows.
Was this decrease in draw weight from Tang/Song to Ming/Qing a result of Chinese military abandoning heavy armor? Or was it the case that draw weights stayed relatively constant, with people abandoning the 160#-plus infantry bows in favor of training exclusively with the poundages associated with mounted archery (90--120#)?
In the Tang dynasty (618--907 AD), the examination syllabus prescribed 1 stone (168#) for infantry archery, and 7 dou (93#) for mounted archery [p. 196]. In the Song dynasty (960--1279 AD), the examination syllabus prescribed 1 stone to 1 stone + 1 dou (148--160#) for infantry archery, and 7--8 dou (104--120#) for mounted archery [paragraph 10Q1].
However, in the Ming dynasty (1368--1644 AD), Li Chengfen's manual mentions draw weights in the range 3--8 li (36--96#), with exceptional archers shooting 9--10 li (108--120#) [paragraphs 11C9, 11C11]. Also, in the Qing Dynasty (1644--1911 AD), we see draw weights ranging from 30 kg (66#) to 8 li (104#) [p. 346, paragraph 12D1, footnote 27 on p. 352] --- and I'm not including the strength testing bows.
Was this decrease in draw weight from Tang/Song to Ming/Qing a result of Chinese military abandoning heavy armor? Or was it the case that draw weights stayed relatively constant, with people abandoning the 160#-plus infantry bows in favor of training exclusively with the poundages associated with mounted archery (90--120#)?
This is very interesting, Justin. Maybe the increasing use of the firearm was the result of the general decreasing draw weight of the bows used in later Chinese Dynasties.
Armour technology reached its zenith during the Tang Dynasty. Maybe that's why draw weight was so high.
Armour technology reached its zenith during the Tang Dynasty. Maybe that's why draw weight was so high.
Justin,
Three things have occurred to me.
Three things have occurred to me.
- 1. Over the years the bows increased in efficiency so the greater poundage was unnecessary.
2. Did you take into account the differing values for the weights between dynasties? The Chinese foot became progressively longer from dynasty to dynasty. If volume measures followed suit, a stone would contain more mass as time progressed.
3. Particularly in the recent dynasties, could the standards have been lowered so more people passed the military exams? These is a suspicion in the modern world that increased pass rates in exams are the result of easier questions rather than better education (':lol:').
Yes, those are good explanations too. I did notice the mass of a stone/li/dou changed over the dynasties, so I based the conversions on the kilogram numbers presented in the book.
Are U know something about Dan? How could we convert it?
I think that the variations all took place within a specific concept: that an archer had to display a maximum strength of draw (tested in later preiods with a special strength bow) and ability to shoot accurately with conventional bows. The basic concept was that in battlefield shooting, the archer had to conserve his strength. Some of the accounts of the examinations were not very specific about whether the tests were for mounted archery or foot archery.